Angelica: Hey everyone! Welcome to Scrap The Manual, a podcast where we prompt “aha” moments through discussions of technology, creativity, experimentation, and how all those work together to address cultural and business challenges. My name is Angelica and we have a very special guest host. Yay!

Leah: Hi! It's great to be here, my name is Leah. We are both Creative Technologists with Media.Monks. I specifically work out of Media.Monks’ Singapore office.

Angelica: Today we're going to be giving a quick TLDR of one of our lab reports and deep dive into something that we didn't get to cover in depth in the reports, such as expanding on our prototype we created, a topic that has some interesting rabbit holes that didn't fit neatly onto a slide, you know, that kind of thing. 

Leah: So for this episode, we are going to be covering technology and innovation culture in Asian Pacific region. If you haven't had a chance to read our APAC Lab Report, here's a quick TLDR.

The most influential technologies from the region are AI automation, AR and computer vision, and the metaverse. China and Japan are leading the growth in AI and machine learning together with Singapore and South Korea. If you come to this region, you might be surprised how people are embracing this advanced technology. People accept it because it is just so convenient and thanks to those Super Apps we have. 

Angelica: To clarify for people who may not be familiar, what are Super Apps? 

Leah: Yeah. So Super Apps are mobile applications that can provide multiple services. And you may have heard of some of the Super Apps such as WeChat in China. Kakao from South Korea, Line app from Japan (that's also widely used in Taiwan and Thailand) and Grab from Singapore, which is used in Southeast Asia. On Super Apps, you can use multiple services from online chatting, shopping, food delivery, to car hailing and digital payments. We literally live our social and cultural life on the Super Apps.

Angelica: Is it sort of like if Uber had one app, but not necessarily branded it's more of just, I'm going to go to WeChat, it'll call a ride, rent a scooter, or order in. You just download one app versus having to download five different ones. 

Leah: Yeah, definitely. But actually for WeChat, it's more complicated, I would say, because there is a whole ecosystem on WeChat because WeChat uses mini programs. Just think of as a microsite on WeChat…

Angelica: Mm-hmm. 

Leah: where they can sell their product and they can have these food delivery services. And for other Super Apps like Line app and Grab it's just exactly like you said. One example is that Burberry launched its social retail store in collaboration with Tencent, which integrates its offline store with mini programs on WeChat. It enables some special features in the store, such as earning social currencies, by engaging with the brand and even raising your own animal based avatars. This is pretty cool as it links up our digital and physical experiences. 

Angelica: Yeah. What I really liked about this example was how technology was seamlessly integrated throughout. It wasn't like, “Hey scan this one QR code.” It went a little bit further to say, “Okay, if you interact with this mini program, then you'll have access and unlock particular outfits or particular items for the digital avatar. You'll be able to actually unlock cafe items in the real store.” So it seemed like it was all a part of one ecosystem. It didn't feel tacked on. It was truly embedded within the holistic retail experience. I know with a lot of branded activations within the US specifically, there's always that question of, should it be accessible through a mobile website or is it something that we can use a downloaded app for? And most clients tend to go with the mobile website. 

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: Because there's this hesitancy to download just another application, just to do another thing. And then worrying about the wifi strength when on site when asking people to download these apps. But it'd be interesting for brands creating these mini programs within a larger Super App that then consumers won't necessarily have to do anything else other than access that mini program versus having to download something. Then there's a lot more flexibility in what brands can do and they're not limited to what's available on a mobile website. They have the strength of what can be possible with an app. 

Leah: Yeah, agreed. So another observation actually from our report is that the metaverse is on the rise in the APAC region. It might outplay the plans laid down in the West. Some platforms that draw our attention are Zepeto from South Korea and TME land in China. 

Angelica: Yeah, and what's cool about those platforms is we see this emphasis on virtual idols, avatars and influencers. From the research that we did, we noticed that there are certain countries that are a bit more traditional culturally… 

Leah: mm-hmm

Angelica: and are strict in how people can be in their real selves to have this sort of escape of the bounds culturally of what people can and cannot be because it's right or wrong or not necessarily accepted. People are going towards anonymity…

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: for being able to express themselves. Sort of like the Finstagram accounts that happen in the US or expressing themselves through these virtual influencers, because then their virtual selves can be much more free to express themselves than their real versions could be.

Leah: And also Asia has a rich fandom culture. So it's not a surprise that we see the emphasis on virtual idols and virtual influencers because it enables the fans to interact with the superstars anytime, anywhere.

Angelica: Yeah. And from a branding aspect of things as well, virtual influencers and avatars can also be much more easy to control. Like all the controversies that happened because someone did something either way back in their past or something recently, that makes brands nervous about being able to endorse real people because people are flawed. With virtual influencers, you can control everything. You have teams of people being able to control exactly what they look like, what their personality is, what they do, and that flexibility and customizability…that's a lot more intense than it would be for a real person that has real feelings.

So there's some limitations on what the brand can do, where it's a lot more flexible with virtual influencers. 

Okay, we've covered quite a lot there. There's a lot of really interesting examples that we see within the APAC region that definitely could be applied within Western countries as well. With this said, we're gonna go ahead and move on to what we did for the Labs Report prototype and expand a little bit more on our process.

Let's start with: what was even the prototype? For the prototype we leveraged Zepeto. Zepeto is a metaverse-like experience world platform…insert all buzzwords here…where it allows users to interact like you would for a Roblox world that you go and experience to, but it has additional social features to it.

So what we would think of as an Instagram feed or something like that, it has that embedded within the Zepeto platform. So instead of going to Instagram to talk about your Roblox experience, those two experiences are integrated within one platform. What we also wanted to achieve with this prototype is leverage a technology that originated from the APAC region, and specifically Zepeto. Zepeto is available globally for the most part, with a few exceptions, but it originated within South Korea. We really wanted to use Zepeto because it's available globally for most audiences and it takes the current fragmented way of how the metaverse worlds are created and integrates them with virtual influencers and social media.

With these gamified interactable experiences, the social aspects are really what makes this particular platform shine. And we are also doing this because the metaverse even a year or so later is still an incredibly popular topic. People are still having a lot of discourse about what the metaverse is, what it can be, discussing how brands have already interacted with their first steps into the metaverse, how they're going to continue to grow.

And this is part of what we do a lot at Media.Monks. We get a lot of client requests for similar types of experiences, whether that be Roblox, Decentraland, Horizon World, Fortnite…and Zepeto is just a great platform that no one's really talking a lot about within the Western dialogue, but it's incredibly powerful and it reaches so many people. We saw that it was an amazing platform that put the promise of what the metaverse can and will be to the next level.

Leah: Yeah. I also like Zepeto because Zepeto not only has Asian style avatars and it enables you to customize your avatar from your head, body, hair, outfits, and even poses and dancing steps you can have. So with Zepeto you can purchase a lot of outfits and decorations with the Zepeto money, which is a currency that you earn by app purchases or being more active on the platform. 

Angelica: Yeah. There's two different types of currencies that Zepeto has. One of which are called Zems…i.e. gems. And then there's another one, which are coins. For creator made items, you can set a price for how many Zems you want them to go for. Anything that's created by users can only be sold by Zems, which are very difficult to get free with an app. That's where, you know, the free to play tends to come in. With a Euro you can get 14 Zems, so then you can buy more digital clothing. There are coins that you start the experience with that you can use to purchase Zepeto-created items. And so that's kind of how they have that difference there. 

Leah: But my favorite part about Zepeto is the social aspect as you mentioned earlier. For me, it's like TikTok in the metaverse because it has the Feed feature.

You know, there are three pages of the feed: For you, following, and popular. Under the feed you can see live streaming by the virtual influencers and you can have your own live stream as well.

Angelica: For the live stream that's using some motion capture as well, because it's either pre-made models and moves that are created or people can actually have their face being recognized in real time...

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: to then translate to that virtual avatar. 

Leah: Yeah. Zepeto, they have the Zepeto camera. So with this camera, you can create content with your own avatar and the AR filter, which copies your facial expression quite accurately, and even brings your own avatar to real life. So you can place your own avatar on the table in your room.

Angelica: One part that I also thought was really cool…you had mentioned earlier with the poses. Think about if we see a celebrity on the street, we're gonna take a photo with them. Right. We can't just let that celebrity pass by without being like, “oh yeah, I totally saw JLo in Miami,” you know? The “take a photo or it didn't happen” type of thing, haha. There's a version of that on Zepeto. Fans can take a photo with you with their virtual avatars with your virtual avatar. So it takes the virtual autograph, of sorts, to a different level. You can live vicariously through your avatar by having them take a photo with your, your favorite celebrity or your favorite influencer. So I really love that aspect of being able to build that audience virtually as well. 

Something also that's really cool about Zepeto is within those world experiences, the social aspects are still very much ingrained in there. It's not just, “Okay, you have this separate social feed, you have the separate virtual influencer side, and then you have the world.” They're all integrated.

An example of this is the other day we were testing out the Zepeto world and we were all in the same experience together. When someone would take a selfie, and that's right: there is a selfie stick in this experience and it looks exactly like what you would imagine, but the virtual version of it too. And when someone takes a photo or a video, it automatically tags people that were within that photo.

So it's generating all of this social momentum, like really, really quickly. And soon as you take that photo, you can either download it directly to your device. Or you can go ahead and immediately upload it. What was great for me personally…figuring out how to have, you know, just the right caption... that's something that takes me way too long to figure out what are the right words and the right hashtags. But you don't even need to worry about captions when taking photos within these worlds. As soon as you say, “I wanna upload it,” it automatically captions, tags people, and also gives other related hashtags for how other people could see that experience from you.

So it's very seamless and easy. 

Leah: Yeah. That's amazing. 

Angelica: It's just like the next level of how it makes sharing super, super, super easy, so that's something I really like there too. 

Speaking of the worlds: now, within this next part of the prototyping process, it was up to us to determine the worldscape and interactions. And as a part of the concept, we wanted to create a world that plays into what real life influencers would be looking for when trying to fill their feed. And that is: creating content. Specifically: selfies. And so we created four different experiences that would have the ultimate selfie moment.

One, which is this party balloon atmosphere. Sort of think about these like really big balloons that you can kind of poke with the avatar as you move around, or even like jump on some of the balloons to get a higher view from it as well.

The second was like a summer pool party. You could actually swim in the pool. It would change the animation of the avatar when you're in the water part. And, you know, the classic, giant rubber ducky in the pool and all those things. So definitely brought you in the moment.

The third was an ethereal Japanese garden, so very much when wanting to get away and have a chill moment, that was definitely the vibe we were going for there.

And then lastly, we had the miniaturized city. So what you would think is the opposite of meditation is the hustle and bustle of the big city. And we created that experience as well. There is also a reference to the Netherlands. So you'll just have to keep an eye out for what that is and let us know if you find it.

Leah: Is there a hidden fifth environment?

Angelica: There it is. Yeah. You know, what was interesting is when we were testing out the environment and we were all together. 

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: We created our own room. 

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: And then we thought it was just gonna be the eight of us that were testing it out and then other people, random people showed up. 

Leah: Wow.

Angelica: I was just like, “where did you guys come from?” There were two people that actually used the chat within the room and they belined directly to where that fifth environment was. 

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica:  So it was just really interesting that people one were specifically coming to the world to experience it together.

Leah: Mm. 

Angelica: And then two, we saw a lot of random people. There would be dead spots where it’s just like, “okay it's just one of us in the room.” We're just testing it. But as soon as all of us got in there together and started taking photos, there were so many people that showed up. It's just like “What? This is insane!”

Leah: Was it the recommendation system on Zepeto?

Angelica: Yeah. That's what we're thinking. Because the room that was created…we thought it was not, I guess it wasn't a private room. It was probably a public room. 

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: But it was interesting that as soon as we started playing around and posting content, then people were like, “Okay, I'll join this room.”

Leah: Yeah. Maybe because of tagging as well.

Angelica: Yeah, exactly. And that goes to our earlier point of how really powerful that platform is and how posting would give that direct result of someone posting something and other people wanting to be a part of it. There was one person that liked my post that had like 65,000 followers.

Leah: Whoa. 

Angelica: And I'm like, who are you? What is this? 

Leah: That's definitely a virtual idol. 

Angelica: Yeah, exactly. They only had like six posts though, which was a little weird, but they had so many followers. It was nuts. 

Leah: Actually today I just randomly went into a swimming pool party on Zepeto. I went into the world, people were playing with water guns together.

Angelica: Mm-hmm 

Leah: So I had just arrived. Landed. Then someone just shoot me with a water gown and I was hit. I must lose my block. 

Angelica: Oh no! Haha, that sounds fun though. 

Leah: Yeah, that was fun. 

Angelica:  Was it like a big room? Like how many people were in that environment at once? 

Leah: When I was there, it was around 80 people in the world.

Angelica: Oh, wow.

Leah: Yeah, it's quite a lot actually. 

Angelica: There's definitely something to be said about how there's superfans of Zepeto. Like that's kind of part of the daily aspect of it. Being able to meet people through the social aspects and then hang out with them through these worlds.

But all this to say this entire worldscape and all these interactions that we included within the prototypes were all built within what they call their BuildIt platform.

Leah: It's quite user-friendly. It's very easy to create a world yourself even with zero experience of any 3D modeling software. 

Angelica: Yeah. BuildIt is like a 3D version of website builders. You have the drag and drop type of thing. Where instead of a 2D scrolling website experience, now you have that drag and drop functionality with a lot of different assets into a 3D space. We can also create experiences like this through Unity. The only caveat to Unity is that the experience that we would create there would only be available on mobile devices. And we didn't wanna restrict the type of people that would be able to experience this. So we decided to do it on BuildIt because the end result of those worlds would be able to be accessed on both desktop and mobile. 

Leah: Other than the world space, you can also create some clothes for your avatar to make it look more unique and with its own personality. So in our case, we create a more neutral looking avatar with blue skin. Very cool, they're slightly edgy but approachable. And the process of creating clothes was very friendly. So you just download the template and then add the textures in Photoshop. We chose a t-shirt, jacket, bomber, and wind breaker. And then we touched it up with some Oriental elements such as a dragon and soft pink color, which matches our Shanghai office. Everyone can create their own unique clothes with simple editing of the textures. 

Angelica: Yeah. We really wanted to play within clothing specifically because that's a part of this digital ecosystem of being an influencer. You may have branded experiences that you take part of, or brands sponsor you. Influencers will wear custom clothing either that they design or that they're representing another brand. All those things we wanted to integrate within this. 

So the influencers are visiting this world. They could say, “Hey, I'm in this Media.Monks experience” or “insert brand here” experience. And I'm also wearing their custom clothing. It's sort of a shout out to the clothing as well as the world. So it's at the heart of this larger ecosystem. The world is not exclusive to the clothes…is not exclusive to social. All of those elements are all playing together and this leads to creating social content.

Once we had the world and the merchandise solidified, we continue to build off this virtual influencer style by creating content of our own. What we did is we analyzed popular Zepeto influencers. We even made a list of the types of content they create, which is going to someone else's world, doing an AR feature with their real life self. Being able to do posed photos with other avatars. All those were a part of the social content that we created as a part of this. 

Now that the prototype is ready to go, it's time to think about what the prototype did not yet achieve but that we would really like to see in the future. So one thing that we recommend is: when wanting to create branded fully custom worlds, those should definitely be made within Unity to have the most flexibility. At this time of recording, being able to export worlds means that only is on mobile devices. So, you know, that's something to keep in mind there. 

Leah: For clothing creation, there are some limitations. For example, for the texture, the maximum resolution we can upload is 512 x 512. So it means we can't add detailed patterns or logos onto our clothes. And we can't create physics of our clothing materials. That is another thing that I think the platform can improve. 

Angelica: Yeah. It's not able to show the fuzziness of a sweater or if we're creating a dress or a shirt that needs to be flowy, it won't show that that shirt or that dress is fuzzy or flowy. It'll just be the pattern that's shown, but the texture of how a clothing might feel based on seeing it is not reflected there. So it's a give and take where it's very easy to create clothing items 

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: …but it doesn't go so far as to have a realistic look. 

Leah: Yeah, but I think this is something that’s not just Zepeto. Other metaverse platforms can improve with that because I don't see many platforms can have physics of the clothing itself. It would be great if the physics of the clothing could be implemented in the workspace as well as in the AR camera. It would add extra immersion and fidelity to the whole experience. 

Angelica: Yeah. It would also help with making those small micro interactions really fun. Let's say there's a skydiving experience that's in Zepeto and someone is jumping off of the plane and is doing their skydive.

Leah: Yeah.

Angelica: It'd be cool. If the physics of the clothing would react to, like this virtual wind that is happening, or something like that. Or if it's a really puffy sweater, it kind of like blows up because all of the air is kind of getting stuck in it. Those are just the fun things that make people get even more immersed within the environment too. 

Moving forward in creating branded experiences, having a closer relationship with Zepeto’s support team and development team will be really helpful in a lot of the things that the BuildIt platform has a restriction for. But when collaborating with Zepeto and with using the Zepeto plugin for Unity, then we can unlock a lot of interactions that make the experience a lot deeper. 

The other thing to mention here is it'd be really great to see Zepeto integrate with other social media platforms versus the Zepeto specific one. We've talked a lot about how Zepeto is a really powerful platform because it combines social with the virtual experience as well. And it would just be great if let's say there's an experience that happens in Zepeto and we're taking a photo or video, we say we wanna post it. Could that be post, all in one swoop, be posted to Instagram, posted to Twitter, posted to Facebook and all of those things, instead of this Zepeto ecosystem kind of being stuck.

So all the cool stuff that we're saying, it gets left within this platform and they're not necessarily shared outside of it unless you did the repost thing. That's kind of how it would work with Zepeto, but it'd be really great if all those rich features that we get with Zepeto could be extended to other platforms.

And I mean, there's already the platform fatigue of having to keep up five or many more social media platforms. So auto captioning for Instagram would be great or having an experience in Zepeto and then moving that on to what I wanna post on Twitter that would just make the process so much easier. 

Leah: The full integration of that might take some time…

Angelica: Mm-hmm 

Leah: since there are more things to consider such as data privacy. 

Angelica: Yep. 

Leah: But we might say it's coming faster in APAC. If one day the metaverse platform is integrated into the Super Apps. Just imagine by then it would be truly one ecosystem. 

Angelica: Exactly. It'd be a really powerful way to have things all within one place. Meta has tried with this “connecting what you do virtually and connecting it to other social media platforms” specifically within its own ecosystem of Facebook, but it's had mixed success. There's just not as much of, “Okay. I'm posting what I'm doing in VR to Facebook.” There's not as much of that traction happening as with going in Zepeto, having this experience, posting it, and people randomly show up because of the social stuff. You could see that immediate interaction. It'd be really great to see this integration outside of just Zepeto social into other social media experiences to really expand its reach. Also particularly because of the virtual influencer aspect of things. Just imagine having this facial mocap that you do within Zepeto and that livestream could go to Instagram, Facebook, and multiple platforms at once. That would really increase the visibility of that virtual influencer and the social clout. 

So we're getting towards the end. Let's go ahead and think about what are some concrete takeaways that the audience can implement and use within their daily lives, as they're considering Zepeto. And then also just in general, the APAC trends that we're seeing here.

Something that I think of is: gaming and social media don't have to be separate anymore. Like when playing online experiences, traditionally, it'll be either playing Warhammer on Steam and having the voice app within there, or opening up Roblox and a Discord channel. But those are two separate platforms: one to connect and one to play. With Zepeto, it's really inspiring to think about how those interactions can be in one. And not just voice, but the social aspect and everything that comes with that. It's really the next level of getting closer to what we talk about the metaverse can be. And Zepeto is really inspiring in that way. 

Leah: Yeah. To your point about this social aspect: Zepeto is actually what we need right now. We can't expect everyone directly dive into virtual without connecting them with the social life in the real world. And Zepeto has this potential to bridge the gap between our social life in the physical world and the digital one. 

Angelica: Yeah, Zepeto is a sleeping giant of sorts where it could have huge potential for a global audience. It is accessible in other countries outside of the APAC region, like we mentioned, but there's just not as much buzz around it as the platform definitely deserves. There are platforms that have tried to have the integration that Zepeto has within those three categories of virtual influencers, social media and experiences. But there just hasn't been as much from those other platforms as Zepeto has been able to succeed in.

So like Decentraland, Sandbox Roblox, Fortnite, Horizon Worlds…all those platforms have tried to get this integration, but it just has not been as successful. Something also to keep in mind and why Zepeto is just a really great platform is that there have been brand activations that have happened on Zepeto already.

There have been concerts and virtual representations of BTS or even Selena Gomez going into those concerts. Like what we applauded a few years ago with the Fortnite concert, Zepeto has already been within those realms already. There's a Samsung activation. There's a Honda activation, and a Gucci one as well.

And those are definitely getting a lot of traction and movement with people who are actually part of those experiences. And because it's integrated within its own social media ecosystem with purchasing items with virtual influencers, there's just so much potential for when brands are getting into these spaces, the type of impact and interaction they can have with consumers.

Leah: Yeah. The last thing we learned from this region: currently the West and the East still feel very distinct technologically and also culturally, with some crossover happening, but it's not as much as we would like to see. Things like virtual influencers, technology in retail, Super Apps, increased use of digital payments, those have been used to deepen collections with consumers and enhance ease of use. It would be amazing to see that more widely integrated within the West.

Angelica: Yeah, exactly. There's a lot of cultural and technological crossover to Eastern countries in terms of, you know, the US culture and colloquialisms always make their way around the globe. And it would be really great to see the really impactful technological and cultural innovations that are happening within the East, make their way more holistically towards the West. Not just here or there, but how Google has been embraced within APAC. It'd be great to have some of those APAC platforms integrated in the west. There's a lot that each can learn from each other and build up on each other. It's not necessarily let's distinguish the West from the East, because we talked about that quite a bit, but what is the way that globally we can improve experiences for consumers. And there's a lot of ways technology can empower people to have those deeper connections and how brands can also be a part of that story.

Leah: Yeah. 

Angelica: So that's a wrap! Thanks everybody for listening to the Scrap The Manual Podcast. Be sure to check out our blog post for more information, references, and also a link to our prototype. Remember to check out the Netherlands references and also the hidden fifth world within that prototype. If you like what you hear, please subscribe and share! You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts and wherever you get your podcasts.

Leah: If you want to suggest topics, segment ideas, or general feedback, feel free to email us at scrapthemanual@mediamonks.com. If you want to partner with Media.Monks Labs, feel free to reach out to us at that same email address. 

Angelica: Until next time!

Leah: Bye.

In this Labs report, we tap into the unique tech, perspectives and potential of the region and share some use cases that brands and marketers can apply anywhere in the world.

In this report, you will learn:

• The most influential technologies of each region
• Regional and local trends
• Attitudes toward adopting tech and innovation in the region
• How APAC relates to the rest of the world
• Takeaways to help with brand success

Zepeto Prototype: The Metaverse Reloaded

APAC’s hunger for tech and virtual innovation create an ideal set of circumstances to build a revolutionary new platform. To showcase this, we created an experience hub in APAC’s biggest metaverse platform: Zepeto.

Founded in 2007, TheoremOne is an innovative engineering and technology services consultancy led by Brady Brim-DeForest, CEO; Will Jessup, Founder & Head of Services; and David Kullmann, Partner, Staffing and Embedded Teams. The team advises clients on product strategy, engineering, design, and culture, then partners with them to build and launch technology-driven solutions to their most complex problems. While over 70% of its employees are based in the US and Canada, TheoremOne employs a global team of distributed talent to best serve the needs of enterprises everywhere, including American Express, Intel, Starbucks and Caterpillar.

“With the intersection of marketing, sales and information technology continuing to be a key topic for brands and all C-suite executives, we at S4Capital are building a genuinely integrated offer for our clients comprising best-in-class technology services combined with content and data&digital media expertise,” says Sir Martin Sorrell, S4Capital Executive Chairman. “We are delighted to welcome Brady, Will, David and their colleagues–their vision and ambition will no doubt be a great fit for us.”

A Disruptive Approach to Innovation

We’re attracted to teams that share our mindset to disrupt the industry, and this makes us good fellows with TheoremOne. The team is driven by a strong mission to dismantle an archaic consulting ecosystem and replace it with a distinctive, durable and effective system for transforming the way businesses solve problems. This is reflected in TheoremOne’s small teams, lean budgets and unparalleled velocity, as well as a desire to build cultures of innovation within the world’s largest enterprises.

Among the biggest innovations built by TheoremOne are a series of popular open-source technologies that developers depend on. These include (but are not limited to) Redis hosting services OpenRedis and Vagrant, which predate DevOps tools like containers. TheoremOne aims to enable information through custom software development rather than produce cookie-cutter solutions or integrations. By hiring experts in leading cloud platforms, programming languages, databases and more, TheoremOne invests in talent ideally positioned to help brands navigate digital transformation, full-stack innovation and experience design.

People-Powered Transformation

To achieve its mission of maximizing human potential, TheoremOne has developed a unique operating model: an Operating System for Innovation. This modular service offering enables a more client-centric approach to software development and information technology services, much like the way our API model—another computing metaphor for organizing people efficiently around a common goal—connects the world’s best digital talent around solving specific client needs.

We launched our API to democratize our talents’ ability to spot challenges in the market that we can solve together. Likewise, the structure at TheoremOne is built on principles of decentralized leadership and small, autonomous teams. These qualities breed a culture of extreme ownership to make a significant impact.

And while much of TheoremOne’s talent is based in the United States and Canada, a core belief behind the business is that exceptional talent can be found anywhere. The global team collaborates remotely across borders and time zones to best meet the needs of clients around the world—an approach that plugs in well with our own global team and single P&L. TheoremOne has leveraged its expertise in remote collaboration to help brands achieve similar efficiencies: its remote work transformation service offering fills a growing white space as businesses continue to restructure their teams around digital collaboration.

A Shared Vision

TheoremOne shares many of our own values, from acting like owners and solving challenges together to driving transformation across people, process and technology. Now plugged into an integrated team of digital experts, TheoremOne is better equipped to help build digital products and experiences that people love, all while cementing our investment in full-funnel, transformative technology services to enterprise brands.

The team is led by Nick Fogler, Founder and CEO; and Sam Baron, COO. Founded in 2017, 4 Mile’s relationship with Looker runs deep: Fogler previously led Looker’s engineering team and supported the company’s transition into a larger-scale enterprise before founding his own. Since then, 4 Mile has supported some of the biggest brands to accelerate their strategic initiatives.

The Rising Need to Translate Analytics into Action

As brands transition away from third-party data to first, much has been said about effective data collection—but that’s only half the battle. Many brands are already sitting on mountains of data that isn’t actionable, and the value of that siloed or hard-to-access data pales in comparison to its frictionless counterparts. Throw in the fact that data platforms and dashboards are often overly technical and opaque, and it becomes clear that focusing merely on data collection—not its usability—simply isn’t enough.

Realizing this need, Looker has long been a favorite solution by our data and digital media practice. Others agree; Looker is now regarded as a core part of the Google Cloud Platform (GCP). What makes it special is that teams using the platform can easily integrate data from various sources into intuitive data experiences that are custom-built to their specific requirements. This functionality solves the crucial need of pulling together insights that are accessible and actionable not only to teams in marketing, but also those across the organization.

A Reputation for Excellence 

4 Mile’s significant history and relationship equity with Looker builds upon our own expertise with the platform. Before they worked directly with clients, 4 Mile was hired by Looker as an extension of its product development team. Through this partnership, they developed custom visualizations and third-party integrations in the Looker product code base, deepening their already intimate understanding of the platform. And while 4 Mile’s direct-client relationships continue to grow, solid collaboration with Looker Data Services remains a cornerstone of the business. 

Still, 4 Mile’s proficiency isn’t limited to Looker. By leveraging strong relationships with leading technology platforms like Fivetrain, DBT, Snowflake, Exasol and Keboola, the team has developed a wide breadth of solutions for the modern data stack:

• Designing and building custom data experiences that blend analytical and operational capabilities.
• Transforming raw data into business-ready data that allows end-users to explore, curate and take action on data insights.
• Designing and employing modern data warehouse solutions to support business intelligence.
• Orchestrating movement of high-volume batch and real-time data across the enterprise.

A Shared Human-Centric Approach

Both Media.Monks and 4 Mile believe that a human-centric approach to technology opens the path to better customer experiences. At the same time, successful data-driven strategies must begin with a strong foundation to build deeper, more meaningful connections with audiences. For 4 Mile, this principle has inspired a people-first mentality—valuing diversity, empathy and respect—that informs the team’s approach to partnership. This includes providing training and documentation to enable internal teams to execute new data solutions, as well as building products that realize specific use cases.

With 4 Mile now a part of our team, their existing clients will gain access to a global community of talent that excels not only in data and digital media, but also content creation and tech services. Meanwhile, Media.Monks clients gain even greater access to a powerful bench of analytics and machine learning experts, providing greater scale, deeper data analysis and more data-driven decision-making. This allows for an even more seamless activation of first-party data, unlocking highly effective and engaging experiences across the customer journey.

Challenges from all ends—government regulation, tech platforms and public sentiment alike—suggest 2022 will be the year in which modern brands must adapt their data strategies once and for all. Together with 4 Mile’s exceptional Looker and GCP expertise, we’re excited to empower brands on their journey to achieve top-line business goals at an even greater velocity.

Angelica: Hey everyone! Welcome to Scrap The Manual, a podcast where we prompt “aha!” moments through discussions of technology, creativity, experimentation, and how all those work together to address cultural and business challenges. My name's Angelica.

Rushali: And my name's Rushali. We're both creative technologists with Labs.Monks, which is an innovation group within Media.Monks with a goal to steer and drive global solutions focused on technology and design evolution.

Angelica: Today, we're going to be doing our Labs Report segment, where we give a quick TLDR (too long didn’t read) of one of our lab reports and deep dive into something that we didn't get to cover in depth in the report, such as expanding on our prototype we created, a topic that has some interesting rabbit holes, but didn't fit neatly onto a slide. You know, that kind of thing.

Rushali: Today we are going to be covering…the Metaverse. 

Angelica: The Metaverse!

Rushali: We have a whole bunch of research and resources for anyone interested in the Metaverse to deep dive into it from creators to C-suite. But if you need a refresher on a few things, here is a quick TLDR of the Labs Report on the Metaverse.

Angelica: What even is the Metaverse? It's like this big thing, there's a lot of buzzwords around it. There's a lot of different components. There’s a lot of different opinions about the Metaverse. But what we can do is divide it up into the key ingredients of the Metaverse.

The metaverse is 3D because, similar to the physical world that we live in, the metaverse has a collection of different worlds, all connected together into one ecosystem. One thing that we were talking about internally, as we were creating the Labs Report, we referenced a whole bunch of different ones, but Wreck-It Ralph Breaks the Internet, that particular movie, where they had Twitter and Facebook and eBay, all connected together into this one ecosystem. That's one version of—or one interpretation of—what the Metaverse could be within a 3D space.

Another thing to consider is that the Metaverse is inherently social. This came up a lot, especially during the pandemic, and how experiences are really focusing on not just the singular aspects of each individual person and their version of the Metaverse or what they see the Metaverse as, but also how they connect to other people.

There's also the aspect of the Metaverse in which Facebook, now branded as Meta (at the time of recording), is pushing towards working together within this Metaverse. So not just for fun, but also moving into how do people work within this Metaverse and how people within these more separate spaces connect and work. Something that is also an aspect of the metaverse, which we're going to talk a little bit about within our prototype, is the metaverse going beyond hardware and talking about interoperability.

So there are certain apps or certain games and platforms that are really exclusive to a particular medium. The Metaverse is really thinking towards this interoperability and where you can access the things that we're used to accessing maybe in only one medium, but in multiple different mediums and multiple different ways, like to join a zoom office meeting in VR or like the mix and matching of things.

But essentially meaning: There's a lot of different things going on to make it accessible for a wide variety of audiences, wherever they want to be. 

Rushali: Yeah, the world is headed towards more decentralized and democratized situations and solutions, which make these systems interoperable. So you can have currencies in different formats that can be exchanged.

And if you look at how the virtual world is progressing, it is headed towards something where you do not have to fit into a bucket and you can basically move from one environment to the other quite easily. So the Metaverse is headed towards that. It is trying to use these emerging technologies when it comes to cryptocurrency or blockchain. 

Angelica: It's sort of like currencies, right? In the United States there's the Dollar. In Europe, you got the Euro. And you got all these different types of currencies, but they act as a way to divide between country lines.

Rushali: And not just divide, I would go further and say even discriminate. 

Angelica: Yeah.

Thinking about how all those affect us currently within those different types of currencies, that's where the Metaverse would come in.

So there wasn't this sort of lost currency, just because you have to transfer from dollars to euros or whichever type of currency you use. You could have this democratization of how to even just pay for, and even earn money for goods and services. 

Rushali: The last thing about the Metaverse is the user-generated content.

This place is going to be a collaborative place. We have all seen how much interaction and content gets created on social media platforms. And the Metaverse is just going to be the big nudge for creators to go from not just a 2D space, but involve the entire gaming industry and other online interactions to really push for user-generated content.

Angelica: Yeah, we see this already through gaming as well like thinking about DLC or mods that help enhance the game that's already there. That user generated content adds that extra level from fans, creators, and players that makes them feel a little bit more invested within it. And that's kind of part of the Metaverse, right? Where we're not going to be going into these cookie cutter worlds. That these worlds will be somewhat affected by the people that are participating in them.

So it’s this holistic world that we can't just say one person or one company made it. It's a collection of the many that also makes it customizable. 

Rushali: Absolutely, and it's going to be a lot more collaborative than what we have right now. For example, the Metaverse is going to be able to bring in what the people watching the concert want to do in a way that we can't do right now with, let's say, gravity and other limitations. So the Metaverse is really going to be allowing for products, services, artists, to collaborate with their fans, with their users, with their customers in ways that was not possible until today. 

Angelica: Exactly.

Okay, so we've covered the high level aspect of the Metaverse. Like we mentioned in the beginning, there's so many resources.

So if you want to learn more about the Metaverse and all the deep dives into it, you can see that later on in the show notes and also within our blog post. But for now, we're going to be moving forward towards the types of things that we didn't necessarily see within the Labs Report. We're going to be talking about our prototype, which is something that we do a lot with our lab reports. We're not just researching. We take that a step further and actually create something to show that what we learned has an application within the real world and how it could show itself within different types of contexts and business challenges

Rushali: We decided to build something on Roblox for the Metaverse Lab Report.

Angelica: Yeah. What we wanted to focus on in this prototype and what we ended up creating was a tangible thought piece, an interactable thought piece, on what the Metaverse would be if it was really embedded within our day-to-day lives and wasn't just something that was a one-off or something that we'd go to once but as something that is really a part of our daily lives. And that was divided into: Admin, Social and Shopping. We made sure each room had a unique approach on what we could see each of these types of environments being like moving forward and how they interconnect with each other. And then even later on, we have a bit of an easter egg about how these different types of worlds not just interact with each other really well but interact outside the world. Because that's something we don't see a lot of currently. 

Rushali: In Admin world, you could basically have the central hub of personal information. You could keep your virtual currency there, you could keep an overview of your friends, your stats. Basically your inventory of things that you have.

The second part was the social part, which was this ethereal, thought bubble environment that we created that users could view what other people were doing, could share what they were doing, and would connect with others in real time. Much like what social media allows us to do, but more in a 3D space…more in a Metaverse-y space.

And the last one was the shopping world. The shopping world was a dynamic environment where you basically have countless categories of whatever you wanted to buy, whether it was virtual or physical. You could order food in the Metaverse in Roblox and it would get delivered to you at your doorstep. Or you could buy an NFT of a dress or try on something through a Snapchat lens.

There was a hidden world, which was the entertainment world, but we didn't deep dive into it, because there's a lot of examples of entertainment in the metaverse out there already. 

Angelica: So that was the overview of the prototype. Diving a bit deeper into what our process was: it was a variety of different things because the metaverse is a topic that has been in the works for years and is also something that's currently in progress. So it's not something that we can retroactively reflect on this particular type of concept.

So it's something that's ever-evolving. And so our brainstorm and prototype phase was also ever-evolving based on what was going on and what we were learning throughout the process.

So it was a bit longer of a phase, more than our typical lab reports, because we ended up breaking it up into: What are the different things that we like about the Metaverse? What are the different aspects that get us inspired or what are things that we could explore more deeply within a prototype? And then once we had an idea of all these different worlds that connect with each other and seamlessly integrate within each other, how do we create that? And then what are those worlds? What do they look like? What are the interactions that people have? And so we whittle it down through all these different concepting sessions and user journeys. Our final concept was a semi-homemade approach, as I like to say, because one of the things that happens within our Labs Reports is we set a timetable to complete them at.

And for this one, it was about a month and a half, I think it was. Because of that, we need to really make smart decisions on, okay, based on this prototype, how do we want to demonstrate it? And also to what fidelity and how much interaction. The concept was really playing on the interoperability of the Metaverse.

That's really what we wanted to hit home because there weren't a lot of examples or interactable thought pieces on this concept. So we were envisioning a world and an environment where essentially people could go home from work and be able to check in on their friends from their phone. Then that translates into desktop and they're able to check in on their Admin. Then that goes into Social, checking in on what they're doing in the evening. Then that goes into Shopping, preparing for the day. “Oh, wait, I'm hungry.” You know, all those different types of things that end up affecting our day-to-day lives currently. But what would the Metaverse look like if that was a part of the equation?

Rushali: Awesome. 

Should we dive into why Roblox? 

Angelica: Yes. Why in the world did we choose Roblox ?

Rushali: For starters, I had never interacted with Roblox. I am not 13 years old unfortunately…

Angelica: It's open to everybody.

Rushali: That is true. 

Angelica: But Roblox is considered, at least within the United States, geared towards younger audiences. And they have a lot of moderation policies that really emphasize the fact that it really was meant for audiences, let's say 15 years and younger. But it has some interesting aspects to it that made us choose Roblox particularly.

Rushali: Absolutely, and Roblox is one of the platforms where developing a game is simplified. They use a programming language called Lua, which is often a language used for teaching children how to code. And it takes very little time to grasp the concepts of Roblox and as any game engine, it has a similar interface and layout. But what is interesting is that it's not as complex as Unity or Unreal. It takes away all of the complexities so that even a 15 year old could build a pretty complex game out of it with scripts, building blocks, as well as all of the assets and essentials that you need and logic that you need to build a game.

Angelica: Yeah, and going back to your point about Unity and Unreal. There’s very similar aspects that Roblox shares, but in a much more simplified way. So like you mentioned about plugins and things. Unity has plugins. Unreal has plugins. Roblox has plugins, right? Thinking about customizing interactions, Unity has a way to do that through custom code, Unreal does as well, and so does Roblox. So it's pretty much creating this infrastructure of a general understanding of a lot of these types of game engines, but in a way that's accessible and also powerful in some instances. Another thing that is really interesting about Roblox is the generated content like we mentioned, and how there's a really open type of thought process in how other developers can help other developers. And that's also the infrastructure that we see in other game engines and coding platforms as well.

Rushali:The Roblox community is extremely well set up and there's a lot of support. So if you get stuck on something, there's always a tutorial. Or there is always someone who ran into the same issue, but someone else explaining how to resolve that issue out in the internet for you to build on top of. 

Angelica: Yeah.

Roblox is this dark horse of sorts where, in the coding community, we see like the tried and true platforms. And then Roblox comes in and it's like, “Roblox? Really gonna build for Roblox?” But there's a lot of similarities between other platforms and how the development process goes, that it can really be a powerful tool if leveraged the right way and also access a lot of different types of audiences that may not be available within other platforms.

Rushali: I think while I was researching, I found a statistic that said that Roblox developers are making like, millions of dollars? So if you're a developer, hop on that Roblox train.

Angelica: Choo choo.

The other cool thing about Roblox, and one of the reasons why it was interesting for us to do the prototype on that platform, is really re-imagining what it means to be a gaming platform. Like Unity and Unreal, we call them game engines, but they can do so much more than that. Roblox is a very similar way, in thinking about where Roblox is used traditionally for games and experiences, it could be leveraged for non-game reasons. Blurring the line between these digital events and experiences outside of a game world and really transform it into something completely different and something that matures as the Metaverse will as well. 

Now as much as we talk about how Roblox was great, and there's all the support, there were challenges that ended up coming up in the prototype.

If it was smooth sailing, we would be very suspicious on, wait, why is it all going so well? Or really realistically, are we pushing the bounds enough of the platform, right? Because we are an R&D group after all. And these types of things do come up because we are thinking about how to push these platforms further. So roadblocks are inevitable as a part of this process.

Rushali: One of the things that I've found really hilarious about Roblox is that you cannot upload logos of certain trademarked things. Like we couldn't upload the Media.Monks logo. Or we would get banned constantly for trying to upload something that we didn't know that we couldn’t upload. So you have to really read through the approval process and the agreements of Roblox’s constraints

Angelica: Yeah and this is because the platform was originally, and still is to a particular extent, geared towards being kid friendly. And so a lot of those are considerations of why they have those different types of policies.

Rushali: Absolutely. I think there's a couple of constraints when it comes to Lua and Roblox where certain things are not possible because they have had to simplify the way that their engine works. But it's also quite surprising that the amount of things that are possible to do when things are that simplified. So it's really a beautifully designed environment for children to learn how to code, but also for adults to sit down and really think about how complex things become, like state of the matter, for us as we grow.

Angelica: Like, should it be that complicated? 

Rushali: Yes, exactly. I had a philosophical moment while working on the prototype where I was like, “Do I need to think in such complex ways in life?” 

Angelica: Right.

One thing that it actually reminds me of is how Roblox is great because of the user-generated content. It's able to both support and the community be able to give back on the different types of interactions that fellow developers can do because one developer was able to open source it to everybody. Or, in some instances, for a fee. But let's remember that this platform is thought about and made for children. So with them being some or many of the developers, there are still children. And so they can still be punks like adults are. And one of the things that we ran into a few different times is: we think about how, like, bugs or different types of plugins that we bring in for other platforms can sometimes error out or just make sure to double check where you download things. That's just the general ethos of what we need to do.

And it applies here as well. Roblox is not immune to childish viruses that come up, but there were a few different plugins that we had, even as much as we go to like reading reviews, making sure that it seems reputable. When you download them and click play there are a few viruses that are just like, “Hehe, [username] got you.” And it would just put that on all the different assets and it would take so long to get rid of it. And it would slow down the experience sometimes as well. 

Rushali: See this is why My Chemical Romance’s song “Teenagers” is my favorite song because teenagers are literally the scariest people on the planet. I think.

Angelica: Or preteens, too.

Rushali: Yeah. Preteens, too.

I can't say. The next generation seems like, super kind. But Roblox is where teenagers are, so be mindful and keep your guard on.

Angelica: It's more just making sure, maybe for certain plugins, test it in a separate environment that maybe isn't a part of the actual world that you want to integrate it within just to make sure the plugin is all good and isn't going to slow everything down. Or there are some that you wouldn't be able to use your mouse. Like a lot of them were very benign or minimally frustrating, 

Rushali: Minimally volatile or violent. 

Angelica: Yeah, yeah. But it was still something that took away from the process of developing. So those are some things that we had to keep an eye out for.

Moving on from Roblox, there's other things that just thinking retroactively about the prototype and the things that we were able to do, we're also contemplative on: what are the different things we did not do? What are the things that we hope for the prototype to achieve, but maybe isn't available yet? Or weren't able to do within the timeframe that we would like to see within the future. So one thing that was implementable is how these Roblox worlds could be accessible through an app, accessible through a desktop, accessible through VR devices. It was one of our stretch goals to be able to have it be integrated within VR. So that's something that looking back would be great to implement within future options and something that would be definitely within this Metaverse aspect of things…Or even like a console version. That would be an interesting one to deep dive into.

Within the prototype video, we discussed how someone could integrate their Uber eats account within Roblox and be able to purchase food. And it actually would be delivered as if you had ordered it from the app. That is something that's not currently available, but we would love to see that within feature iterations or as the Metaverse progresses, actually being able to see that fully functioning within our reality.

Rushali: I think integrating APIs when you're in a PG environment is slightly trickier, which is why their entire technological constraints with Roblox are a little more complex because they want to be PG-13.

Angelica: Yeah, exactly.

So we've covered a lot because the metaverse is a lot. What are the different things that we can consider moving forward?

One consideration that comes off the top of my head is the Metaverse is today. The metaverse is tomorrow. But where is the metaverse in between? How do we get to that “Ready Player One” reality that has been talked about, or within Snow Crash as well. What are these different types of Metaverse POVs that everybody's really excited to get to, or it might be like some mixed reactions to those towards the utopian and the dystopian version. But how we get to those somewhat futuristic visions of what the Metaverse could be, it takes one step at a time. It's something that isn't going to be at our doorstep tomorrow, but it will take time for many companies, creators, and individuals for us to get to that point. Thinking about hardware, advancements, software advancements that need to be done to be able to get us to that point, right?

So it's one of those classic, over estimating how much progress we could make in the future and then underestimating how soon we'll be able to get there. That type of classic dilemma. But it could be somewhere in the middle where it will take years to get to the point where we see in “Ready Player One,” or in these different types of things. But it's not to say that the Metaverse isn't going on right now. It is going on right now in these different aspects of the Metaverse. So thinking about virtual reality, augmented reality, NFTs, collectibles, user-generated content…a lot of those are the principles that the metaverse will stand on and will be built off of.

Rushali: Yeah like, basically what's happening right now is all of the key ingredients of the metaverse are available in fragmented ways but they all need to come together. So the interoperability is something that is being worked on by multiple companies across the world, not just for computation and hardware reasons that we can't get to the “Ready Player One” situation. It is something that is here right now, but at the same time, getting built as we speak.

Angelica: Yeah, the investment and participation of these platforms and those fragments today is going to greatly shape and influence what's going to look like moving forward. So it is something where us as a collective of individuals and companies and developers will be able to influence this.

Thanks everybody for listening to Scrap the Manual. Be sure to check out our blog post, in the show notes for more information and references of things that we mentioned here. If you like what you hear, please subscribe and share! You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcasts.

Rushali: If you want to suggest topics, segment ideas, or general feedback, feel free to email us at scrapthemanual@mediamonks.com. If you want to partner with Media.Monks Labs, feel free to reach out to us over there as well. 

Angelica: Until next time!

Angelica: Hey everyone! Welcome to Scrap the Manual, a podcast where we prompt “aha!” moments through discussions of technology, creativity, experimentation, and how all those work together to address cultural and business challenges. My name's Angelica.

Rushali: And my name's Rushali. We're both creative technologists with Labs.Monks, which is an innovation group within Media.Monks with a goal to steer and drive global solutions focused on technology and design evolution.

Angelica: With this podcast, our goal is to share our learnings in another form, thinking beyond physical and digital and go towards an auditory experimentation mindset. This is a form ripe for disruption. We're here to…scrap the manual…of what you typically expect from podcasts like these. There will be informative moments like when we do a deep dive of lab reports. There will also be moments of fun, exploration, and just having this experimentation mindset carry over during our segments.

Rushali: Like the one today called “Challenge The Hosts.” In this segment we are randomly assigned an industry and a challenge, and we brainstorm on the fly what the potential opportunities are in the space leveraging existing as well as emerging technologies. 

Angelica: So let's say, for example, we did gaming and data. How would we break that down? First, we would start by discussing where the industry is, current opportunities, and challenges. Then, we would have an open discussion where we're thinking about what technologies that could help augment and push the industry forward in new and exciting ways. And then we'll have a nice tidy conclusion where we break it down into concrete takeaways that our audience can think about and ruminate on as we’re going about our day-to-day lives and apply it wherever you are.

Rushali: But that was just an example. So we're going to be picking an industry and a challenge that we've never seen before. And the ones today are…Art and COVID-19. 

Angelica: Oh, okay. Okay.

Rushali: What happened with the art industry through the pandemic and how did we face the challenge of COVID-19? 

Angelica: Well typically pre-pandemic, art was primarily in the physical space, like perusing around having this sort of aimless, "let's see what inspires me today" type of mentality. There was the type that had art being more interactive, like actually putting people within a particular space, and a time, and a moment. This is seen a lot within experiential activations. In addition to the immersive art installations we're familiar with, another way it manifested itself was within the digital space.

But it wasn't necessarily as popular or there wasn't as much investment in it because there wasn't as much of a reason for being as now there is because of COVID. With people being separated for safety and health reasons, it changed the whole dynamic of how people interact with art. And it's this open question of how does that change art moving forward?

Does it make things worse? Does it make it better? Is it yes? Both worse and better, you know?

Rushali: Yeah, I just say it's a little different. Pre-pandemic life was like, “let's buy a ticket to a museum or an art gallery.” And oh, there is something that is being exhibited in this part of the world or in a public space.

And then you would get a grant and New York City would be like, “why don't you put this piece of art in the middle of Times Square?”

Angelica: Yeah.

Rushali: But Times Square is not as crowded as it used to be. Or maybe it is crowded right now…who knows what's happening over there.

Angelica: Yeah, just like caution to the wind. We don't know what's going on.

Rushali: Yeah maybe the masks are off, we don't really know what's happening there…we are in Amsterdam. But what has happened is that museums and art galleries have come up with a concept of putting up their physical presence in a digital space. All of these museums and art galleries are trying to create 3D digital experiences. There are ways to push the boundaries of just consuming something on a 2d screen, because you could potentially have VR headsets or like a Google cardboard and immerse yourself and feel like you are in the physical space of that particular museum or an art gallery.

But there's limitations to that as well. So computation has limits and you will never get an IRL (in real life) experience. Maybe you'll get something that's more fantastical, maybe Metaverse-y to not say the buzzword, but that's where initially everyone was like, “Okay, drop the physical space. Museums are closed, let's put everything online.” 

Angelica: Yeah. And that's something that happened through Google even a little bit before the pandemic. They had certain partnerships with museums where they actually did their famous Google 360 view of what we're familiar with but they did that for museums as well. And they put them online for everybody to see, and that became one way of accessing it.

But there's another level of it for this experience called Museum of Other Realities where you can put on a six degrees of freedom (6DOF) VR headset and be able to have this experience of feeling like you are physically perusing a museum of how we usually would. What I really like about those types of experiences is they use VR to its potential and what it's capable of.

They understand the constraints and they also understand the possibilities and they say, “let's figure out what are the opportunities within VR and really play that out.” Like in VR, physics is something that the creator can really play with. So if you don't want to have gravity, you don't have to have gravity.

Or if you want to have this giant chaos of particles swimming around you, that's also totally doable. And obviously that's really difficult to create in real life without like millions or billions of dollars, but it's something that's really possible in VR.

There was even one I remember about a year or two ago where people could actually try on a particular outfit and actually strut the runway in that particular outfit and what it looked like. It was something that I was able to partake in because it had different opportunities. I wouldn't normally go into museum and just wear the art pieces. That's just something that's really frowned upon in a lot of places. But in VR, that's something that is an opportunity. 

Rushali: Yeah, you can't walk into the Louvre and touch the Mona Lisa Right?

Angelica: All the oily fingers of people. No, it’d ruin the artwork, but you could within this particular medium. 

Rushali: Yeah their digital space allows for that level of immersion and interaction. 

Angelica: Yeah.

Rushali: Okay, so do you think people are going to go back to the way of consuming art that we used to? Like, are people going to go back to museums or has the world changed…for the better? 

Angelica: I would say overall, “yes and.” Because there's a museum out in the UK where they had an Alice in Wonderland experience that was actually hosted during the pandemic and they had two different versions.

They had a version that was physically on site for those who were able to attend and were able to align to COVID protocols that were set up. But then there was the other group of people who may not be in the UK or maybe just didn't feel comfortable attending at a particular moment in time. So they had a VR version of it.

And that's sort of the thing that I'm really optimistic about the silver lining of all of this: that there is another level of physical and digital accessibility of experiences where we don't necessarily have to be in these huge large markets like New York or LA to be able to partake. These are the types of things that people can experience at home, or if they're in a smaller location, still being able to have access to those cultural moments that push humanity forward in interesting ways and inspire artists and creators in different ways. It doesn't necessarily have to be location-specific anymore. It can be just wherever there's an internet connection. Or not even in VR, we’ve been focusing a lot on VR. It can also be in a WebGL experience, or some of these other mediums that could be more accessible to people.

Rushali: Absolutely. There's been a big push towards accessibility and you really don't have to be in the big spaces, the big cities, right? When I look back and I think of a lot of the initial interactive exhibits, they were reliant on activations by touch or by people coming together and moving their hands and arms.

And their presence, the heat of people in a particular space. But all of those interactions are going to have to be reprocessed and rethought and redesigned. And they're going to have to be able to activate these experiences in a different way, because people are just not going to hug each other. 

This is reminding me of a pop-up window display in New York city that, when you touched the window, there were lights that were going all the way from the window to the center of the installation, where there was a heart. And everyone touching the window was collectively pumping the heart with lights. So that sort of activation is kind of questionable today. Not many people are going to want to touch windows at the same time, or like just after someone else has touched it, like what, even is the sanitization process of that interaction. 

Angelica: Yeah, or there's just like a huge jug of hand sanitizer nearby. Like, it's interesting though, because there's touch as we typically think about it in terms of like the hands touching each other or hands touching a window, but then there's other ways that we can really push that and think about it further than what we're used to because we have to. Because there's people that still want to have that physicality. That's not going to go away and it's never going to go away because that's just part of humanity and how we connect with people is that physicality aspect.

There is technology available that allows the feeling of touching something, but not actually having to touch something like, “How can that work?” Well, actually it could be through these pulsating air bursts. So you could be touching a screen in air quotes, but you're not actually doing that because there are these air bursts that are actually hitting your palm. Making it feel like you're touching it, but you're not, it's a lot more safe. 

Rushali: To add to that there's another way that we could possibly detect an interaction and that would be blinking or winking.

Angelica: Okay, okay. 

Rushali: Cause when you're wearing a mask, your face is covered except for your eyes. Those are the only things that are visible. You could possibly have a lot of interactions with blinks and winks, and we are going to get really good at signing through our eyes. 

Angelica: Yeah. Or it could just be Morse code which…it has to be taken in stride because if they're blinking too much then it's like, “Are you okay? Should I call the doctor?” It's like, “Oh no, I'm just participating in this experiential activation.” It's like, “Mmhmm. Yeah, uh huh, it's a lot of blinking you doing there.”

Rushali: What is interesting is that everyone has had to innovate and that has directly impacted a lot of trends. In your opinion, would NFTs have had such a huge spike in our lives if people weren't locked down or if we weren't in a pandemic because blockchain and NFTs and cryptocurrencies are concepts and technologies that have been here for a while, but only recently surged…why is that? And yes, the world was headed towards a more democratised currency situation but this convergence of art and NFTs has come up in the middle of the pandemic and it seems like they're probably related, you know? 

Angelica: Yeah. I think it was because for a lot of emerging technologies, there wasn't a clear reason for being. Or there might have been, but people might've been really skeptical about it or can maybe see it in action and visualize how it would play within this larger ecosystem. Technologies like VR, AR,  cryptocurrencies, NFT’s, these are…they are all in a very similar boat, but now because of the pandemic, people are like, “Oh yeah, of course. That totally makes sense for VR.” Or even for augmented reality, they're like, “Oh phish duh. Why didn't we do AR before?” You know?

And it's sort of like hindsight's 20/20 where if the pandemic hadn't happened, there might not have been as clear of a reason to be doing this. Because for augmented reality, you don't necessarily have to touch a shared device to be able to participate. It could be something that's personal or individualized with each individual's phone kind of helps go around a lot of the COVID safety protocols that are happening and actually be able to be compliant to those.

Now that we have the sort of reason for being, it's pushed these technologies much further than it would have been ordinarily. And it has not just been exclusive to those innovators, but everybody has had to become an innovator in order to really keep up and catch up with the pace.  

Rushali: Absolutely. Everyone has been forced to put on the shoes of an innovator or at least someone who has to start applying these technologies in a way that is usable on a day to day basis.

And you bring up VR because I remember pre-pandemic, a lot of museums would have these installations where you would have to touch and pick up a headphone or a headset and put it on and watch a screen. And you'd have to engage with the art piece in that way. But doing all of that is not kosher anymore. 

Angelica: Or not without a bunch of protocols. Or disinfecting and sanitizing between people…there's just a lot more to think about now. Where before it was like, “Oh, just put on a headset. Leave it there for the afternoon.” People do what they want. Yeah. 

Rushali: Now people have started doing AR activations where you kind of click on your phone and you see the description of what the art piece is about on your phone and the phone plays an audio.

So instead of you touching a third party headphone that everybody else is touching, you are only touching your phone. I think the other part of the story is, again, that there will be museums that are going to use VR headsets, but I wouldn't want to go into one anymore. Like personally, I would try to invest in a headset myself rather than going into a space that is publicly open and wear a headset that a lot of people have been wearing. And there's more access to technology, and as we see technology evolving, we also see it becoming more accessible and affordable. And the pandemic has created a lot of disruption and opportunities. 

Angelica: Yeah, it's all just because our shared reality has become different now.

And from a psychological standpoint, people have had the sort of shared trauma that has happened. Like globally to varying degrees, we all have familiarity of COVID and what it has done to people, businesses, places, governments. And now it's just thinking: how do we move on from the shared trauma and push it towards an opportunity or opportunities to make the most out of the situation. Because unfortunately we can't change what has happened in the past, but what we can do is make sure that we’re prepared for the next pandemic. Hopefully not for a very, very, very, very long while, but it's also being able to figure out how to adapt to everybody's new realities on what each individual feels comfortable with.

Because some people are like, it's super easy for them to move on. But there's others that it's really going to take a while. And how brands, museums, artists…they're kind of in this middle ground where we have to be open and accepting to these audiences. Both types of audiences. But truly trying to be critical about how we do this through the technologies that we really love so much, 

Rushali: 100% on point.

So, Angelica, we've covered a lot. What do you think are the main takeaways from this? 

Angelica: COVID has affected a lot of industries, art being one of many of them. And we've covered really only art in particular, but art has a really interesting way of affecting other types of industries. Like how entertainment and brands get inspiration from art. Even like obscure industries like construction, right? 

Rushali: Yeah, like banking and currencies, even. For example, what's happening with NFTs is people are buying art and it's also influencing how copyrights work and the policies are being rewritten. The interesting part is the world seems to be more polarized, but at the same time, the world seems to want to be more democratized.

So the pandemic, in my mind, really has been an eye-opener of sorts to a lot of people. The ecosystems that we are living within one, not working well for us, not that what we were doing before the pandemic was gloriously terrible, but the way that things are right now, we have to reevaluate our way of life.

And art comes right in the middle of the questioning. And of the rethinking, the philosophy, and the prospect of redesigning and coming up with new solutions and new perspectives and looking at things differently. And we are headed in a very interesting direction. 

Angelica: Yeah, there's this rapid digitization of sorts that's happening, but there's also been this increasing need to feel connected to other people.

Those are the two things that the pandemic has been able to affect people by. And people who've thought they might've been introverts or maybe somewhere in between are now reevaluating. Like, “Oh, I actually like to see people more than I usually would.” Or people who thought they're extroverts are like, “Hmm, I kind of like just staying at home more.”

And the lockdowns didn't really affect them as much. It's just thinking about, okay, now with this rapid digitization: how do we have this nice middle ground of meeting up in the physical world and being able to connect with people how we felt was normal at the time and it was natural to us. And how do we connect that to ways we can connect people physically or digitally together without necessarily having to be in the same place.

And it's just thinking about how these other platforms can help us with that. Thinking about the accessibility of it. How do they collide and in just really thinking: where do we even go with this and the next five years? It's a whole new world out there. 

Rushali: Yeah, humanity's priorities have changed. People are trying to figure out what's more relevant and what is more important? 

Angelica: Yeah, for sure. 

So we made it! We made our very first episode of Scrap the Manual. We did this for a multitude of reasons, but one is just to give you a little sample of what it's like and what you can expect from the multitude of Scrap the Manual podcast episodes that we'll have up and coming.

So we'll be doing other ones like Lab Reports, more of these “Challenge The Hosts,” and we'll also be doing other segments as well which will be announced very soon. So just stay tuned to how be able to share those with you all. In the meantime if you like what you hear, please subscribe and share! You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcasts.

Rushali: If you want to suggest topics, segment ideas, or general feedback, feel free to email us at scrapthemanual@mediamonks.com. If you want to partner with Media.Monks Labs, feel free to reach out to us over there as well. 

Angelica: Until next time, see ya later.

Rushali: Tata!

Rushali and I are both Creative Technologists on the Labs.Monks team, which gives us the opportunity to explore and play with some of the latest digital innovations. A lot of our work is focused on not just exploring emerging technology’s potential, but also making it more accessible and understandable for audiences at all skill levels. As much as we are developers, we’re creatives and creators, too. Because of that, our podcast aims to “scrap the manual” by challenging pre-existing notions of what creativity and technology looks like and can be. You can listen to our first two episodes here.

Since we want to scrap the manual in all senses of the term, our goal is to keep  things informal and fun, because we already have enough seriousness in our lives considering the past two years have taken the world on a ride. Scrap the Manual is the podcast you listen to when you’re up for learning something new but also want some levity in your day. We’ll still be asking the tough questions—no doubt—but we’ll make sure that it’s still easy to listen to and feels like you’re right there in the room with us.

And with that, let me introduce our first two episodes with you to give you a taste of what’s to come—maybe with a dash of FOMO to encourage you to give them a listen. 

Diving Head-First into Industry Challenges

Our first episode follows our “Challenge the Hosts” format, where Rushali and I call on our customized randomizer, a tool that pairs an industry with a challenge, live. Once we have an industry and challenge, we brainstorm solutions on the fly about what we could do to improve it. No pre-scripted material for this one; it’s a 100% off-the-cuff discussion. If you’ve ever wanted to be a fly on the wall observing an R&D team in the heart of a brainstorm, this is the closest you’ll get besides working with us.

During this episode, the randomizer landed on a combo that couldn’t be more relevant as we tackle yet another stage of lockdowns worldwide: COVID-19 (challenge) and art (industry). In this discussion, we explore how the pandemic influenced art throughout the last couple of years, and how it will move forward, too. This was the perfect opportunity for us both to align our shared passion for creativity and technology as the world of fine arts—including museums, art galleries and experiential activations—quickly pivoted and adapted to emerging technology that until now has been waiting for its moment. From exploring NFTs to some of our favorite hybrid installations throughout the past year, we cover a lot of ground in our first episode.

Giving an Inside Look into the Lab

Our second episode takes a different approach, expanding on our recent Labs Report about the metaverse. As we roll out new reports, expect more episodes that dive deeper into some of the concepts explored within. The idea isn’t to repeat ourselves; these episodes instead serve as a companion to the reports by digging in a little deeper.

For the metaverse report, Rushali and I open up on the process (and some comical missteps) in creating a prototype in Roblox that demonstrates the metaverse concept of interoperability. To illustrate what the metaverse could look like if embedded into our daily lives, we built a series of spaces: an admin area to manage one’s personal details and assets; a social environment where you can engage with others or see what they’re up to; and a shopping world where you can try on and buy both physical and virtual goods.

Since we as a team always want to push technology to its limits, we always run into surprising challenges during our prototyping process. Episode two gives listeners an inside look into some of the quirks of the Roblox platform as well as its developer culture—and because Roblox is viewed as a pioneer in the metaverse landscape, our process may give you some insight into what to consider when building your own metaverse experiences.

So, where did we run into some trouble? It turns out we got trolled by young developers more than once… but you’ll have to listen to the episode to find out how. (On that note, you’ll also hear about Rushali’s deep-seated fear of teens—sorry Gen Z, we still love you).

What’s Next?

That’s all for now, but you can look forward to more episodes every other month. In addition to the two formats already mentioned, look forward to our third format: “How do we do this?” where our audience (that means you!) submits ideas to Rushali and I and we put our brains together to figure out how we can make it real. If you already have an idea in mind that you’re just aching to make possible, feel free to email us.

Rushali and I had a lot of fun sitting down to talk about all things creative tech, and we’re just getting started. Remember: this is a podcast for anyone interested in tech—whether you’re a passionate tech evangelist, a creative looking to learn more, or someone who simply wants a behind-the-scenes look into what the Labs.Monks are doing and thinking about. I hope you enjoy our first couple episodes and let us know what you think. Stay tuned for more!